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How introverts and extroverts work higher collectively

00:00:00: Introduction
00:02:39: Why working with introverts/extroverts issues
00:04:38: A easy definition of extroversion/introversion
00:06:23: Some introvert traits
00:08:33: Some extrovert traits
00:11:58: Concepts for motion…
00:12:26: … 1: you/me/we
00:15:35: … 2: discover what works
00:18:38: … 3: be looking out
00:23:37: Last ideas

Helen Tupper: Hello, I am Helen. 

Sarah Ellis: And I am Sarah. 

Helen Tupper: And that is the Squiggly Careers podcast, a weekly present the place we dive into the ups, downs, ins and outs of your world of labor, and provide you with some concepts for motion and a few instruments to check out that can assist you together with your growth.  We actually, actually care about you feeling assured about your profession, about you having a little bit of readability about what you need to obtain, and also you with the ability to go after what you need.  And so hopefully this podcast can be a helpful lesson that can assist you to do this.  And if it’s the first time that you’re listening, it’s price figuring out that we create plenty of totally different assets to assist you.  

So, we have got issues like our PodSheets, they’re one-page summaries you could obtain afterwards and so they’ll provide help to to take motion.  It will have all of the concepts that we discuss as we speak.  We’ve got PodNotes, which we placed on social, so be sure to’re following us @amazingif on Instagram or LinkedIn.  They’re good swipable and shareable summaries, if you realize different those who they could assist.  And in addition, PodPlus, which is a weekly get-together with a gaggle of like-minded learners.  It is fully free, it is half-hour, it is Thursday at 9.00am within the UK, and it is a good place to dive in a bit deeper into what we’re speaking about as we speak, which is, how can introverts and extroverts work higher collectively? 

Sarah Ellis: The best way that you just began that, that does very a lot sound like, significantly for our common listeners who will know that I am extra of an introvert and also you’re extra of an extrovert, that we now have to work higher collectively since you had been like —

Helen Tupper: The place might this concept have come from for this podcast?! 

Sarah Ellis: However really, for as soon as, that is not the place this concept has come from.  I feel it is extra some insights that we have learn and we all know it is a matter plenty of persons are desirous about.  And we additionally do recognise that as any individual who is comparatively introverted, and I feel it is in all probability honest to say very extroverted, we’ll come on to that, we work rather well collectively, however that has taken work.  So, for that relationship to be higher, for us to see all of the optimistic advantages of getting totally different types, I feel over time we have been increasingly more intentional and considerate about that; whereas initially after we had been simply buddies, I feel you do not actually care in the identical manner. 

Helen Tupper: Properly I feel now, I see it as like an actual energy of ours.  I feel, I do not know, 5, ten years in the past, I in all probability would have been like, “Oh, this distinction can typically be a bit tough”; whereas now, as a result of Sarah and I are actually entering into writing our third e-book for the time being, all I see is the advantages of it, as a result of I simply know that it will get higher due to what Sarah brings and I do know that I convey stuff too.  And it isn’t simply the e-book, it is plenty of issues.  And so now, I simply actually worth it and I see it as nearly a not-so-secret energy of our partnership, is that we have each obtained these variations in introversion and extroversion. 

Sarah Ellis: And I feel this issues for everybody for 3 causes.  Firstly, most of us do not work alone, we work in groups, so there’s at all times going to be a combination of introverts and extroverts.  And a few individuals can even establish as what’s typically described as ambiverts, the place they type of go, “Oh, I really feel like I am a little bit of each”.  And as we have at all times stated, or I at all times say, I at all times assume labels aren’t useful, it is simply extra about self-awareness.  So, as we describe this as we speak, simply see which certainly one of these feels most such as you. 

I feel the second purpose this issues is that whenever you do that properly, you’re simply more practical, you obtain a greater stability.  And really, there’s some actually attention-grabbing articles and tales you possibly can examine introvert/extrovert mixtures.  Wozniak and Steve Jobs at Apple might be probably the most well-known one.  However that is as a result of they convey very various things, they convey very totally different strengths. 

Then thirdly, I do assume typically extrovert/introvert relationships could cause friction.  These relationships can really feel like there’s plenty of battle, they will simply really feel difficult.  And perhaps you recognise that within the work that you just do, so that you assume, “Properly, I’ve set to work with this particular person”.  It is perhaps a supervisor, it is perhaps a peer, and also you simply know they have a really totally different fashion and strategy.  And also you’re pondering, “Properly, how can we constructively transfer ahead in order that we will get a few of these advantages that we’ll describe?” 

Helen Tupper: Properly, I feel till I might actually labored with you for so long as we’ve now, I feel I might in all probability solely actually considered introversion and extroversion in all probability when it annoyed me.  More often than not I do not give it some thought, however whenever you’re sort of annoyed or discover somebody tough, you are like, “Oh, that is as a result of they’re like this”.  And I feel now, since clearly we have labored collectively so intently for fairly a very long time now, I am like, “Oh my gosh, there is a actually totally different alternative on this”.  If you can begin to essentially take into consideration what is the profit that, you realize, me being an extrovert and also you being an introvert, what is the profit that that brings, after which I nearly look out and look ahead now to working with introverts due to it.  That is very totally different to the place I in all probability considered this years in the past. 

Sarah Ellis: So, a quite simple definition of introversion and extroversion, a type of go-to one in case you’re in search of an actual shortcut, is commonly, the place do you get your power from?  So sometimes, introverts recharge and re-energise.  I consider it as like, what does it take to plug your battery in?  If you have to recharge your battery on your laptop computer or no matter, what does that seem like for you?  And introverts are likely to recharge solo, by themselves or maybe in very small teams, significantly with individuals they know very properly. 

Extroverts, however, recharge with different individuals, wish to be surrounded by different individuals, in all probability fairly blissful in huge teams.  And we’ll dive a bit of bit extra into simply being a bit cautious about making assumptions round introversion and extroversion.  I at all times assume it is actually vital that folks describe it for themselves, you realize, like what does that imply; what does introversion imply to me?  As a result of for instance, I feel there are many people who find themselves way more introverted than me, and I feel their working fashion would in all probability nonetheless be very totally different to mine.  So, we each is perhaps, on the floor, introverts; however then, say in case you labored with that particular person versus me, it’d really feel very totally different.  So, I feel simply give everyone the chance to go, “Oh, after which that is the way it exhibits up”.  However definitely for the 2 of us, that is undoubtedly true about how we plug our batteries in. 

Helen Tupper: Yeah, I feel two good questions are, which one do you establish extra with, introvert or extrovert; not placing you in a field, you are not solely that, however which do you establish extra with?  And, how does that present up for you, to the purpose that it may be fairly nuanced and we’re not making an attempt to say, “Because of this, these are 5 issues that decide the way you present up at work”. 

Sarah Ellis: So, we thought it might be useful simply to begin by Helen sharing the introvert traits she sees in me, after which I will share the extrovert traits that I see in Helen. 

Helen Tupper: So, these are some introvert traits that I undoubtedly see in Sarah rather a lot.  She’s very reflective and considerate.  So, Sarah stays in her head for much longer than me and considers issues, I feel, extra deeply, which could be very, very helpful.  Additionally, considers issues from different individuals’s views as properly, I see that so much.  She has fewer relationships than me, however they’re deeper, they’re longer, and I feel you’ll be able to ask extra of these individuals due to that.  So, I type of see Sarah with the ability to amplify asks of the those who she has these relationships with.  A particular discomfort with massive teams, so we simply keep away from them principally, and the concept of huge teams.  So, that is perhaps creating an enormous Squiggly Profession neighborhood, and Sarah can be like, “Oh, I am unsure about that”, simply the concept of it, as a result of she’ll be pondering, “Is that efficient?  Is everybody going to be snug in that?” simply the concept of it.  However then the truth of it. 

I might say the truth of it’s simply, Sarah will solely take pleasure in a big group — it isn’t that she will be able to’t be in it, however she’s going to solely need to be a part of it for a shorter time period.  So, for example we’re having an enormous occasion with plenty of individuals.  Sarah will certainly be there, and she or he’ll undoubtedly present up and have interaction with plenty of individuals, however I can nearly see the power waning.  I can see when Sarah’s like, “That is it now, I have to go”.  It is usually a time once I’m kicking in, however Sarah’s like, “Helen, I am off.  You type this bar invoice and also you begin the following one, since you’re clearly going to maintain going”!  So I undoubtedly see sort of a cutoff.  Does not imply Sarah would not become involved in them, however there’s undoubtedly a cutoff line when it is sufficient. 

I see a really totally different dynamic from Sarah in small-group conditions versus social conditions; simply behaves actually in another way, ultimately, surprisingly.  So, to the purpose about, do not assume all introverts are the identical, typically Sarah will be a lot chattier than me in sure conditions and I was like, “What is going on on right here?  I am the chatty one”, and I might be quiet and assume that truly it is nervousness.  I now know that it is the manner that Sarah feels accountable for that state of affairs, is to speak in it rather a lot, as a result of I do not know, I feel it is nerves; whereas I by no means used to understand that.  

So, I feel watch out to not make assumptions.  However they’re a few of the issues that I see in you that I now know that that is how introversion exhibits up for you. 

Sarah Ellis: So, some extrovert traits that I see in Helen.  Firstly, she radiates power in a room, so that you’re by no means going to overlook her, you will at all times know she’s there.  And we have recognized one another for a very long time, and even in our college cohort, that was true.  However I feel significantly in huge teams, it is nearly like your power will get larger, the larger the room, the larger the group.  I am in search of the hearth escape and also you’re identical to, I do not know, I really feel simply glowing. 

Helen Tupper: I might been in search of the slide. 

Sarah Ellis: Yeah! 

Helen Tupper: I might be like, “The place’s the slide within the room?  We are able to have a celebration! 

Sarah Ellis: It is actually useful as a result of it simply means I haven’t got to do it, so it is so good!  Socialising is certainly a supply of enjoyment and it is one thing so that you can look ahead to, and I simply see how vital it’s in your weeks.  And it is humorous, I feel typically there will be a night the place you will be out nearly partying and I is perhaps sitting at residence working and I simply typically assume, “Oh, properly we’re each blissful in our work.  It simply seems to be very totally different”.  I see much more blurred strains and bounds between work relationships and friendships with you.  I imply, I actually overheard you on a name yesterday suggesting to any individual like, “Oh, ought to we exit for a drink?  Ought to we get dinner?”  And I used to be pondering — 

Helen Tupper: I imply, that is gone within the diary, that is completely gone within the diary. 

Sarah Ellis: Yeah, I do know, I heard you then doing it.  I used to be simply pondering that occurs so much much less incessantly with me.  A few of my greatest buddies are from individuals I’ve met at work.  However I feel you do this very incessantly and nearly with plenty of totally different individuals, and once more, to the purpose the place I am not assuming you are a very good listener.  So, I feel typically individuals have these very floor stage assumptions, “Oh, extroverts, they’re type of, I do not know, loud, noisy, they at all times shout the loudest”.  And I am at all times like, properly, you are unmissable, that is undoubtedly true, however you do not really feel the necessity to shout the loudest, you do not at all times really feel the necessity to have presence by means of interrupting or saying probably the most.  And we talked earlier than, I feel you are a very good listener and getting even higher on a regular basis, and you do not have that nervous power that I undoubtedly have and sort of must work fairly exhausting now on making an attempt to not have, as a result of normally it isn’t that useful.  So, they’re the extrovert traits that I see in you. 

Helen Tupper: I feel it is really, it is a helpful factor to ask your self, you realize, if I establish as an extrovert, how do I feel that exhibits up?  But additionally, to get that performed again by any individual else, since you would possibly get some fairly shocking insights in that, which I feel may very well be simply helpful.  It is extra knowledge on your growth, as we frequently say. 

Sarah Ellis: And I noticed lately that Adam Grant, who has talked earlier than about being introverted — and there’s a nice e-book if you’re an introvert referred to as Quiet, The Energy of Introverts by a woman referred to as Susan Cain, and I feel Adam Grant and Susan Cain know one another, and he talks about what an introvert means to him.  So really, he stated for him, it isn’t about the place he will get his power.  So he stated, for him being an introvert isn’t about the place you get your power, it is the way you deal with stimulation.  Introverts are energised by individuals too, and I actually recognise that, I am nonetheless actually energised by individuals.  However he goes on to say, “We’re simply simply exhausted by loud events, shut talkers and countless houseguests.  I am not anti-social, I am simply pro-quiet”.  And you realize whenever you learn one thing and also you’re nodding so exhausting, and also you’re identical to, “Sure, that”?  So, I am actually blissful to see individuals simply so long as they go, so long as they go away! 

Helen Tupper: Among the WhatsApp messages that Sarah and I’ve about social conditions, in all types of how, are very attention-grabbing and by no means to be shared exterior of our WhatsApps!  So, we’ve obtained three concepts for motion now, which we’ve undoubtedly tried and examined these.  So, they’re very a lot issues which have labored for us in sort of managing this stability.  And I feel what we’re making an attempt to say is, you would possibly in all probability not have the type of partnership the place you’ve got obtained any individual that you just work with as intently as Sarah and I do, who’s your reverse, however you possibly can type of spot individuals who may need a barely totally different desire to you and use these concepts for motion to work higher collectively. 

Sarah Ellis: So, thought for motion one we’re calling “you/me/we”.  And the primary stage of this concept is to establish key classes the place you assume your variations would possibly present up.  So, this may very well be as a venture group, this may very well be sort of one-to-one, so like me and Helen speaking about this collectively, you could possibly do that as a staff.  So, the three that Helen and I got here up with had been relationships, pondering types, and the way we progress initiatives.  Most likely fairly common, so not less than I might think about two of these three can be useful for most individuals.  You additionally may need another ones that we have not considered.  And the concept right here is that you just type of give everyone the chance to do, “Properly, what does that imply for you?” by way of like, so let’s take “pondering fashion”.  So, if I stated to Helen, “So, Helen, how do you wish to assume issues by means of?”  You’d say…?

Helen Tupper: “Out loud, with others, in a short time”. 

Sarah Ellis: After which I might say, “Okay, that is actually attention-grabbing.  What that appears like for me is time on my own, not being placed on the spot, being fairly reflective, after which sharing once I’m prepared”.  So, already you possibly can hear, listeners, there’s comparatively excessive ranges of distinction there.  So, we have finished the you/me bit.  So, you then transfer on to the we, which is the good thing about us working collectively and bringing our distinction.  So, the we is the good thing about us then working collectively.  And check out ending a press release that begins with, “Collectively, we can…”  So for example, for instance, Helen and I are engaged on a podcast matter thought, and we’re making an attempt to determine, is that this going to be helpful for our listeners?  What let’s imagine there’s, “Collectively, we can make sure that we actually assume it by means of correctly, that the analysis is there, actually make sure that it connects with our insights, with what we’re right here to do, as a result of that is what I might convey.  I might ask and reply plenty of questions of myself in my very own mind with out speaking to anybody else”. 

Helen Tupper: So true!

Sarah Ellis: “Whereas Helen would put that concept on Instagram and LinkedIn inside a minute, and she or he’ll get a great deal of dwell suggestions”.  And so then collectively, we have got all of these totally different knowledge factors that helps us to determine nearly, we get each quickness and high quality to then go, is {that a} good podcast matter; is that one thing we should always transfer ahead on?  And so there, it is only a actually particular instance of how really we’re we’re type of higher collectively.

Helen Tupper: Yeah, and I actually see that on the opposite issues, so like on relationships for instance, we’ve a greater vary of relationships, as a result of Sarah has these those who we will make the large asks of as a result of she’s actually invested in them deeply, after which I’ve simply actually random those who we will go and ask about, “Oh, I met this particular person at an occasion two weeks in the past.  Let’s faucet that up”.  And the best way that we progress initiatives is I feel as a result of Sarah’s naturally reflective, she’s pondering by means of the implications of every part, the longer-term outcomes.  And since I am identical to, “Oh, I’ve seen this, why do not we give it a go?  Let’s attempt it this week”, you get numerous tempo and fast issues from me, whereas you get the large wins from Sarah.  So, I see this on a regular basis, however I feel it’s a must to have that dialog collectively.  I feel that is the important thing bit, like what’s you, what’s me, and the place’s the we profit in it? 

Thought for motion quantity two is to note what works.  And I need to begin with a threat right here.  So, I feel the chance of this may very well be that you just would possibly take a look at different individuals and assume, “I must be extra like them”.  So, I is perhaps pondering, “Oh gosh, Sarah’s wonderful.  She is; truth.  I must be extra –“

Sarah Ellis: Thanks!

Helen Tupper: It is all proper, I will provide you with that.  It is the top of an extended day, everyone, everybody wants some optimistic reinforcement.  However I is perhaps pondering, “Oh, I must be extra like Sarah so as to like, I want to only do away with all of my extroversion and all of my Helen-ness, and I simply must be like Sarah”.  And equally, Sarah as an introvert would possibly assume, “Oh, so as to succeed on this, I have to grow to be an extrovert”.  And we have talked about this earlier than in the beginning of our careers.  Sarah, I keep in mind whenever you had been going into that gross sales position in early careers and also you thought you needed to be extra like an extrovert and lose your self and be extra like that so as to succeed. 

Sarah Ellis: I feel I believed that for fairly a very long time.  I feel it took me fairly a very long time to let go of the type of extrovert, perhaps typically expectations, and I feel I labored for fairly just a few extrovert leaders.  So, you possibly can’t assist however type of be what you see. 

Helen Tupper: Sure.

Sarah Ellis: And so, as a result of I might obtained these aspirations and people ambitions, I used to be like, “Oh properly, if I need to do these sort of roles with that scale of affect, then I have to appear and feel and sound a bit like that”.  However inevitably, as quickly as I let go of that, I used to be manner higher at my job. 

Helen Tupper: Properly, that is the factor.  I feel the issue with making an attempt to show your self into any individual else is that it would not actually make you very blissful, and it would not make you as efficient as you will be.  I keep in mind once I used to work at Capital One, which was an organisation that I beloved working in, however I might say that the profile of the individual that succeeded was fairly totally different to me, as a result of they actually valued these analytical deep thinkers, who I might say oriented way more in the direction of introversion.  These are statisticians and analysts, they’re just like the super-brains, and making an attempt to be like them would have made me very sad and doubtless very ineffective as properly.  So, what we’re making an attempt to say is to note what works.  So, in these conditions that you just’re in, it may very well be a venture, it may very well be the tradition of the corporate, you are not making an attempt to repeat any individual else, however you are attempting to note what works. 

So, for example I am in an organisation, there’s extra individuals like Sarah than me, for instance, I is perhaps pondering like, “What’s it that Sarah does brilliantly?”  And I feel that is a very good query to ask since you’re actually seeing somebody’s strengths in that state of affairs.  So, I is perhaps like, “It is the best way she pauses earlier than she contributes her pondering, or it is the best way that she displays on the finish of a gathering”.  No matter it’s, I will be very, very intentional about noticing what works.  And the concept is that you just’re including that on to how you’re employed.  So, slightly than type of taking me away, I am not making an attempt to be much less extrovert, I am not making an attempt to be much less Helen, I am simply making an attempt so as to add on a few of the good issues that Sarah does.  And you then’re type of simply being your self, however a bit higher for that state of affairs, slightly than shedding bits of your self within the course of. 

Sarah Ellis: So, thought for motion quantity three, we’re calling “be looking out”, and we got here up with this thought after which realised that neither of us actually did it.  So, that is in all probability an motion for each of us as a result of we predict this is able to be one thing that is actually helpful and we had been each like, “Oh, yeah, we do not actually we do not actually make this occur”.  So, the rationale we have referred to as this “be looking out” is we would like you to look proactively for possibilities and alternatives to share your introversion, extroversion expertise, as a result of a few of these issues are traits however most of these traits then translate into expertise for the good thing about different individuals.  And I feel we in all probability all do that to some extent, reactively, by accident, simply by means of the course of our on a regular basis doing our jobs, however that is about being way more proactive and intentional. 

So, in case you stated to me, “Okay, so that you like to essentially assume issues by means of and also you’re reflective and also you’re good at sort of asking and answering questions of your self, have you considered how and when that may very well be helpful for the remainder of the Wonderful If staff?”  I might be like, “No”.  So, I’ve not.  I do not assume I’ve deconstructed the type of expertise that I’ve ended up with, the sort of learnt expertise that I’ve obtained higher at, partly due to my persona, after which gone, “Who else, when else, the place else might these issues be helpful?” after which be actually sort of beneficiant in going, “Oh, properly this can be a venture that feels fairly advanced or the place we’ll have to do some deep pondering.  I’ve obtained some useful expertise right here, perhaps I could make some options, perhaps I might help to upskill another individuals within the staff”. 

Helen Tupper: And I sort of assume I do know that I can create a fast neighborhood round an thought that we have got, to get some insights or to check one thing, and I feel I might actually assist somebody.  I’ve by no means considered it earlier than, however I used to be having a dialog with a buddy final week.  He is launching one thing, it is fairly early days of it, and truly, if I might considered it, if I might been extra looking out, I might have stated, “Inform me three issues that you are a bit anxious about or three bits of assist you want”.  I might simply create a bit of WhatsApp group of three or 4 those who I might assume may very well be of assist, and I might be like, “Look, why do not we get a WhatsApp group?  They’re going to be capable to provide you with some actually fast concepts and suggestions which may get you began”.  That’s very easy and energising for me to do, however as a result of I feel I wasn’t looking out, I hadn’t thought how might my extroversion assist that particular person; I simply did not counsel it.  It is solely, “I’ll do this after”.  After this podcast, I will get in contact with that particular person and be like, “I used to be serious about you while I used to be speaking to Sarah, and I’d be capable to assist in a manner that I hadn’t thought by means of”. 

Sarah Ellis: I suppose what that is, is basically making a optimistic bias in the direction of sharing what you realize.  So, we at all times say in Squiggly Careers, “We should always all share what we all know so everybody can succeed, slightly than hold these items to ourselves”. 

Helen Tupper: Properly, I feel it is much less about what you realize.  I feel it is a optimistic bias in the direction of serving to individuals together with your desire.  A few of these issues aren’t all data.  It is that you just want to assume issues by means of and so that you’re sort of going off, “I will have a optimistic bias to assist individuals with my desire being an introvert”, then how are you — I do not know, a few of it is a expertise, a few of it is a ability, a few of it is simply extra of a desire.

Sarah Ellis: Yeah, although I suppose to do it successfully, as a result of I am now pondering if I am really going to do that; to do it successfully, you’ve got obtained nearly translate.  As a result of a desire, I feel you usually do not assume that — as a result of nearly, it’s a part of who I’m now, you realize, and so long as you are snug with it, it is a part of your id.  So, you are basically taking one thing that is extra perhaps persona, id, desire, and you will must do a bit of labor of turning it into, “Properly then virtually, what would possibly that seem like for different individuals?” 

So, one instance you gave me after we had been testing this concept, and believably we do take a look at these concepts earlier than we discuss them, you stated to me, “Oh, properly naturally I am good at doing introductions”.  So, introductions, as a result of you realize plenty of individuals, you are able to do plenty of introductions.  So, that is nearly like a kind of issues that you have to give based mostly on — your extroversion means you could give plenty of creating connections, creating introductions.  So, I feel I nearly have to undergo that technique of going, “Properly, what do these preferences and persona traits then imply by way of what I’ve obtained to present?” after which be looking out for, “Who am I going to present them to, when I will give them”.  Feels like plenty of work to do, principally! 

Helen Tupper: However hopefully, like after we talked about at first, what does this seem like for you, that very first query, so I establish as an extrovert, what does that seem like for me?  Or what does Sarah see in me as an extrovert?  I feel these are a few of the issues you could go, like Sarah stated, “Oh, Helen places power right into a room”.  So, what does that imply that I’ve obtained to present?  I’ve obtained, you realize, if somebody desires to begin one thing off, I’ve obtained lots of power, I might sort of create that in a room.  However I do assume it’s actually, what have I obtained to present based mostly on my desire?  And there will be hundreds, there will be completely hundreds.  And in case you’re struggling, as a result of that may very well be fairly a frightening query, I feel, ask different individuals like, “What are the strengths that you just see in me?” you will get to a few of these insights.  However that then would possibly provide help to to attach the dots whenever you’re type of looking out for how one can assist individuals. 

Sarah Ellis: So, we hope that is been helpful for all you introverts and also you extroverts, equally vital extroverts on the market.  In case you have another concepts, instruments or methods that you have seen have labored rather well in your expertise, or one thing that maybe you’ve got learnt that you just’d wish to share with our listeners, you may get in contact with us at any time.  We’re [email protected].  We additionally love to listen to from you your concepts, so what would you want us to cowl within the podcast?  Or, if there’s any specialists you’d significantly like us to strategy to interview as a part of our Ask the Specialists sequence, tell us that too. 

Helen Tupper: And all of these concepts for motion that we talked about can be summarised within the PodSheet.  So, you’ll find that on our web site, amazingif.com, or on the present notes.  And in case you ever cannot discover something, simply give us an e mail. 

Sarah Ellis: So, that is every part for this week.  Again with you once more quickly, however bye for now. 

Helen Tupper: Bye everybody. 

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